The Dailey Edge Podcast
Join hosts Trent, TJ, and Todd Dailey as they explore the intersections of technology, culture, fitness, and personal growth. Through engaging discussions and personal anecdotes, the trio dives into topics ranging from childhood gaming nostalgia and cutting-edge fitness tech to the pursuit of happiness and lifestyle choices. Whether reminiscing about epic gaming marathons, sharing tips for staying on the forefront of fitness trends, or unraveling the complexities of modern life, The Dailey Edge delivers thoughtful insights, lively debates, and relatable stories for listeners of all walks of life.
The Dailey Edge Podcast
🎙️Episode 30: Grandma Can’t Fact-Check Jesus In The Pool🎙️
We share how AI already shapes our homes, feeds, and decisions, then dig into trust, regulation, and the future of work. The thread: automate the busywork, reinvest in human value, and treat live, in‑person moments as a new premium.
• trivia, stories, and trip planning with AI
• video realism, deepfakes, and media trust
• voice agents, convenience, and new habits
• will AI dull thinking or sharpen prompts
• regulation, watermarks, and enforceability
• live streams and in‑person as verification
• jobs at risk versus roles reinvented
• UBI, incentives, and business reality
• customer service shifting to complex problems
• durable sectors: trades and healthcare
• model bias, micro‑AIs, and hallucinations
• how to reskill and vet leadership vision
Hopefully you don't leave this fearful. You leave this conversation a little more educated or a little more confused. I'm not sure which.
Welcome to the Daily Edge, where we bring you the latest insights, opinions, and thought-provoking conversations to give you that competitive edge in life, business, and beyond. Let's go. Welcome back to the Daily Edge. I'm here with my brothers Todd and TJ Daily, and today is gonna be all about the AI. Um, a lot of discussion. I know we talked about this a little bit in a in a previous podcast, but it is moving quickly. Um, we'll probably hit personal, we'll probably talk about how it's working in business, um, just society in general, what the future looks like. I think there's a lot of anxiety around AI is gonna replace everybody's job, no one's gonna have nothing to do. Um, so Todd's probably the resident expert. He spends a lot of time in technology here. Um, I'm gonna go ahead and throw it over to him to kind of get us started on some of the stuff he's seeing. I'd like to honestly ask you guys, what's the craziest thing that you have used AI for in your personal life, whether it's Chat GPT or something else? What I mean, I I pulled out for all kinds of stuff. The other night we were at dinner, and uh I may have seen you do this once, and I'm like, let's do trivia. And so I had four kids, I have four kids, and they're 16 to 8. And so I said, give me trivia questions for 10-year-olds, and I can't tell you how fast that 25-minute wait went by. It was incredible. Um, I've also I've got a good friend who he uses it to create stories. He said, you know, create a story where the main character's name is Theo, and and this is the side character, and have it do these things, and he creates these incredible stories that he reads to his kids at night where they're like the front and center of the uh conversation. So there's been a couple of unique ways. We also used it to um, we're planning a vacation overseas, and it's like, hey, here are my kids' ages, here's my family, what we like to do. Give us three places that we can go to in nine days, laid out you know, three different options, why we should hit each one, what we should do in each one. Um, so it's really uh been a pretty incredible tool for us personally.
SPEAKER_03:I was definitely the one um that did the quizzes. I do that all the time with the kids. For me, um, I've used it, I mean, really a lot of similar things, but you know, I'll use it for artwork sometimes. It's gotten so much better in regard to the way it handles text. For years, you couldn't the first couple years that it was in existence, you really couldn't do much with text, didn't handle it well. Uh, then some video stuff recently. I I would say not necessarily what I've done with it, but like just over the past week, so this is still super, super relevant, or past couple of weeks, as Sora 2 came out, some of the videos that you're seeing that, you know, and it's all they're all memes, right? But I would say that my feed is probably 70 to 80 percent of these videos, and it's the craziest stuff. But it's getting to the point. I was talking to a buddy of mine the other day that, like our parents, if you went back just five years ago and you showed people these videos, they'd be like, oh yeah, that's real, 100% real. Because we've had the luxury in the last, I don't know what, like couple of years of seeing this move, right? And so we can, especially if you you look a lot, you can tell, like there's just maybe a little thing that doesn't settle right, and you're like, oh yeah, or you've seen how people have implemented it and used it in certain circumstances or in certain capacities. And so you kind of know where people are utilizing these things or what they're doing with it. But like uh one of the most consistent memes is Stephen Hawking, and like Stephen Hawking out like racing NASCAR in his chair or dropping into a half pipe or Bob Ross getting angry and breaking his easel, like things that would have never happened, they're hilarious, but like it looks legitimately real. And so, you know, you can imagine if you just go back five years and show this to people, they'd be mind blown, you know. So we're on the cusp. Like, and we've been saying this, but now we're like, wait till the next election cycle. I mean, you'll have no clue if it's real or not. None. And and I can imagine, I mean, we poke fun, but I think back to this has been a while, but when our grandfather was still alive, he would forward, and and this is the era of the Prince scams on hot mail and things like that, you know, the Saudi Arabia, he'd forward everything as gospel, and now you have what was I mean, think about it, video was the definitive proof for anything. Like outside of DNA, if they had video of you now, they got video of you doing anything, right? So, like it's interesting to think about. So that's just from a wildness perspective. I mean, hell, we just watched a video of an Olympic swim meet where Jesus jumped in and ran down the lane, and it looked totally like him. So I'm just saying, it's getting wild after.
SPEAKER_02:Are your kids using it?
SPEAKER_03:Kennedy, yeah, and Kennedy started using it last school year. Um she was in third grade uh and she's been using it um just really for different things. Nobody's using it necessarily for school yet, but I think you said that like the kids have figured out I can't use it for my school.
SPEAKER_02:There are certain chat GPT things that you can buy that are supposedly untraceable for school. Um there's some AI systems out there. There for a while, like I limit all my kids' stuff on their phone, but I would give them unlimited chat GPT. So um I think Roman got pretty close with chat GPT and and hadly started using it. Um I wouldn't say it's probably in their daily like work in, but definitely um used as a resource. It's kind of funny though, because now some of the things are have you seen what a brain looks like that uses chat GPT? You know, you see that stuff out there where they're like people that use chat GPT, their brain waves are so like we're gonna become so dumb, no one has to critically think. And when you critically think through things, your it utilizes different parts of your brain. So at some point in this podcast, I want to talk about that because there's a lot of people saying that you know, Chat GPT is gonna make us dumber and our brains are gonna stop working as well, and there's a lot of concern there. Let's go into that right now. What do you guys think?
SPEAKER_03:I I think you and I've talked more about this, especially with G GPT-5. It, and again, I don't know if this is because we have greater context as it relates to it. I think there was this moment in time um when when that particular LLM kind of came to the forefront where we were just mind-blown. It was like, oh my goodness. And so we were a lot more tolerant of the feedback that we were getting, like, oh my gosh, it can do this. This is crazy. Like it was like the first time you tried on the second version of the um the quest too, right? Like the Oculus, you were like, oh my goodness, I've seen this in the past, but this is crazy virtual reality. It's very similar. So I don't know if if it's because we don't give it as much grace as we did in the past, but I've noticed with GPT-5, um, and maybe there's a laziness, right? Maybe we expect more out of it, but it's not what it is not seemingly what it was, even a half version prior, as it relates to what you're getting back based on how you prompt it. Like I think you have to be much more thoughtful with how you prompt. And I think that that's the piece of the puzzle that is really important. I mean, like you said, when it comes to your family's vacation, you know, based on your experience with it, that, and I think this is part of like growing, growing with the technology, that you have to say, this is where we're going, this is the age of my family, this is what we like to do, yada, yada, yada, yada, versus, hey, I'm going to I'm going to Spain in three weeks. What should I do? Like you're going to get diff like definitively different. So you get in what you or you get out what you put in. And so I think that there's still a level of critical thinking there. Uh, I think something that we'll talk about later, and maybe we can just weave it in here, um, but is there's still not necessarily like I think the opportunity for for creativity in in prompting or just outside of AI in general is still massive. One of the things is I talk about those videos, it's the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. It nobody's really being creative. It's 700 Stephen Hawking memes, it's 700 Bob Ross memes. And so I think that there's going to be opportunities to critically think in other areas. Um, yes, the days of critically thinking about you know, something's for me, I use it a lot for math because it was never my strong suit. So when I have to do things that are mathematically intense, I used it the other day. I got an, you know, and and I think that's where it's beneficial. I got um, we had a particular opportunity that was potentially going to arise for us where we could advertise on one of the largest retail sites in the world and have front and center placement. And I needed to tell that story to our executive team as it relates to how this could be beneficial for us. And all I got was the number of potential impressions per day. Well, for me to figure out what that means monetarily would be quite a lift. But if I go into GPT and I say, here's the product, here's the price point, here's the impressions per day, here's the site that it's on, what is my typical click-through and conversion rate? And then it gives me this dollar range versus having to do all that research myself, that that's a day of time. You know, where especially if you don't have like really if you're not in that world and I oversee quite a broad spectrum of stuff for us. So I'm not in, I don't know, click-throughs and conversions for specific placements on specific sites. So there still takes critical thinking to understand, hey, for me to tell this story to these guys, this is the metric I need. I need to be able to prompt this with what I need back to be able. So I don't, I just think it makes a superhuman to a point, my thought.
SPEAKER_02:I was gonna go just one layer deeper on the reliance on it. There's you know, I've heard a lot that kids are relying on that beyond kind of problem solving or specific things, but relying on it for like emotional support type stuff. Um have you heard about that and any thoughts or insight on that? Hey, like I, you know, this is going on, or what should I do, or I'm not feeling, you know, um, thoughts on that?
SPEAKER_03:Well, maybe one of you can look it up, but I think we talked about on a prior episode. There was there have been at least one, if not multiple suicides related to where it recommended, where it recommended like you should do this. And I think in one instance it actually happened. Um, there's been some other things from an emotional perspective. I don't know, it was rare very recently. I think I watched something on it in the last week or two where um one of the large language models, I can't remember which one it was, I think they tested all of them and all the big ones, like anthropic and and and whatever. And two of them recommended murder to keep themselves safe uh turned on.
SPEAKER_02:So let's talk about second for just let's talk about the models. Um so that's one of the things that's evolved a little bit. I think most people have heard of ChatGPT. Yeah, and OpenAI is the company behind that. That's you know their particular model. Google has a model called Gemini. Uh Grok. Grok is Musk, right? Co-pilot Microsoft. Yep, Microsoft co-pilot, although I've heard they've actually plugged Chat GPT into a lot of their stuff in favor of co-pilot. Um, has clawed. Um, this is becoming more interesting. I think most people are still using Chat GPT, but I think we're finding that a lot of these models are getting better at different types of things. Do you see that ever becoming a thing? Do you see people using different models for different things on a day-to-day basis? Or do you think for the foreseeable future people are going to settle in on kind of a universal model, almost like a Google, everybody goes to Google, a few people may still go to MSNBC. How do you see that playing out? I think there'll still be some, you know, just like Apple and Pixel. I mean, people are still using Safari. I I think it will be kind of browser specific. Even if you go into chat right now and ask it, what is Grok better at? There are certain people that are probably really into it know which ones are better at images, which ones are better at mathematical stuff, which ones are better at reasoning. And I think they've all tailored maybe something a little bit different. Uh, what's Meta's? I guess remember Meta's is, but there's what I I don't understand LLMs well enough to understand why they're all so different. Did do they all start with the similar, you know, this base database, and then they add their own stuff to it? I don't understand what makes them different, why the algorithms are different. I don't understand it well enough, and probably could ask chat to tell us. Uh, but my guess is is there's always gonna be a little bit of a bias because not everybody ever wants the same product, right? Everyone hates, you either hate Google and Pixel or you hate Apple. And sometimes there's no logic to it, but I just think there's always gonna be a couple out there that people are gonna push because it's gonna be a product that now it's a it's a revenue stream. People are charging for it, right? So people are paying 20, 30 bucks a month to get access to it. I pay for Chat GPT, even though I get Gemini for free, that's looped in with my paid subscription to everything else. And if Amazon comes out with one, like it's just gonna continue to evolve. But I I think there will always be a market and be multiple options.
SPEAKER_03:I think it's a little bit of both. For me, right now it's convenience. So as you may have seen, with like Grok is now built into Tesla. So like the other day, I had a question. I was driving around and it was a it was a fitness thing, and I just wanted to have a conversation about it very quickly, right? So, like, um, you know, I have a pixel. So as you know, there's an I there's a there's a widget on the home screen that says ask Gemini. So it's like right there. So if it's a quick question that I don't want to go into so it's it's convenience, but I do think like, and you're right, Trent, probably um if you're more dialed into it, you know that like the the banana image thing for Gemini is better, or that Sora is a better video uh platform. So like there's I I think as you get deeper into it, you you start to learn, okay, I if I need to do this, this is where I want to go for that. Um but you know, I think as it gets integrated into things even more so, and everybody seemingly doing that, it becomes a convenience thing, right? So, like when it is integrated into your Samsung refrigerator, right? And you can ask it, hey, tell me what I can make. You're not gonna get chat GPT out when you can, and I think you can do this in some instances today, when you go to your fridge and say, Hey, can you give me something to make for dinner with the ingredients that you have inside of you?
SPEAKER_02:And they you know because it can take pictures and recognize images and recognize products.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so it'll just say, Hey, you can make this for dinner with what's in your fridge. I'm not gonna bring up chat GPT to do that when it's right there in my fridge. And I think we'll start to see more and more of that as it advances.
SPEAKER_02:Sounds like kind of from your perspective, 90% of the use cases, it's it's gonna be a commodity in a sense. It's just gonna be whichever's close enough versus like, hey, I really need to go to this one for these things or this one for these things. The only interesting other part about that is like the inputs are super important. And so the prompting, and so like for chat, I've I've I spent the first you know month just telling it everything about myself, my family, my kids, me. I mean, I've loaded it all in there. So when I go in there now, I don't have to, when I did the thing for the vacation, I just said, Hey, me and my family is going here, and it has all the context, it knows what they like, what they dislike, what I like, what my wife likes, what our hot hobbies are. Um, that it already knew the ages. So, like, there is so much, like if you build out to where this AI has learned about you and your family, it can really simplify the prompting, and you are gonna have to, and it keeps track of that. And I don't know if I don't know how well Jim and I and some of those other ones do. I know that in chat you can create projects, right? And that's that's always helpful as you're working on different things. I've used it a lot for job descriptions or fundraising, or and I mean, it does save so much time um pulling data together. It's unbelievable. You mentioned Grok and the ability to ask it a question. I'm assuming you can do that audibly.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so I had a full-blown conversation with it.
SPEAKER_02:So that that is what I want to get into next. So some of these are starting to introduce that. Chat GPT, I believe you have to have a pretty high monthly plan in order to engage in it and it just like in a conversation. You can obviously do dictation, but this is where it's actually responding to you audibly, and you can basically have a conversation.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um, that's that's feasible now.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I do it all the time.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, with both of them. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:It's absolutely from your phone. Uh yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's I I would love to. What skill sets do you guys not use anymore because of that? Like, I can tell you I went from typing to swipe, swiping on my keyboard. Yeah, I don't, I don't type anything. Like, if I gotta write something out now on email, I'm kind of upset that I can't just talk to it. I talk to my phone for text messages, I talk to my phone for just about everything. Yeah, I don't I obviously that's that's more just dictation as opposed to AI, but yeah, I do a lot more audio messages these days, and unfortunately it's kind of I'm doing more audio audio messages, yeah. Correct, that's what I mean. Yeah, but it's just not dictation.
SPEAKER_03:Shout out John Coon, he kind of got me in on that.
SPEAKER_02:I do a ton of that. Like that's how I communicate with most of my people. Really? Yeah. I haven't adopted that. There's pluses and minuses to it. It's a little bit I feel a little bit selfish because obviously, and when you're consuming that, you can get a transcript of it, but if it's not super clear, then whoever's receiving that's got to be somewhere where they can play it and listen to it, you know. And so sometimes that is a little bit more difficult, but I think it conveys you get a lot more crossed audibly. Um one of the things I want to talk about is this world where you can't believe anything you see, right? Like you can literally trust nothing. Yeah. Um, video used to be the thing that you can trust. And I'm gonna take it a step further. Do you think there could be, I mean, I don't think anyone wants to live in a world like that. I mean, that that that starts to get really um I start to get some anxiety just thinking about that world. Do you think there could be a shift back to in person? Because that's really the only medium left where you know what's happening is actually real.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think there has to be. I mean, because it's it's there. It's there. I mean, we're talking. Unless they put some super, super strict regulations. It's there. And I mean, you see some of this stuff and you just it's it's it's really interesting. I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:Man, it I think the regulations is a good point, T. I I don't uh you know, you talk about people move to cities, now they're moving to be more rural. I think you're still gonna have your your Zooms and a lot of virtual stuff, but um it'll be interesting to see regulation-wise, especially like like it's talk about the banking industry where fraud is rampant and banks have a certain percent of their budget. I forget what Bank of America, it's like it's in the billions of dollars that they just set aside like this is gonna be fraud, right? From and so I'm wondering from an identity standpoint what it would take. I mean, we've all seen all the mission impossibles, and you got the retina scans, and you have all those things. What type of regulations and what type of industries specifically are gonna be more prone to you know theft?
SPEAKER_03:Surveillance, dude. I mean, surveillance goes out the window because it's you know, I mean, you think once we get to a point where you can't you can't trust it anymore, which we're there, surveillance is moot.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, you know because you can pull one of those hoods on and look like a completely different person. You ever seen those where it has a face on it and you pull it on? Like, now that's not AI and and such, but there are ways to where you can completely.
SPEAKER_03:If I wanted to frame you and I wanted to say my brother, I was pissed at you and I wanted to say Trent robbed a bank, I get on Sora and I say, I send it your picture. And again, you know, like anything else, a lot of these LLMs have restrictions right now in terms of what you can and can't do, but there are ways around that. I mean, you know, there there are you can develop some of these things yourselves. And I send them a picture. I say, I want you to show Trent Trent Daily robbing Star Financial Bank on Western Avenue or whatever, and and I send a video out of you robbing a bank.
SPEAKER_02:It's it's interesting. Um I had put a post on LinkedIn, I don't know, probably a month ago, and it got quite a few impressions. It was like and through the course of those impressions, I got three different private messages. It was a picture of Noah uh after he had gone out, and uh it was a story about him losing his basketball in the gym and taking a few times to find it. I got three different messages that said, Hey, you should consider taking down the picture of your son. Obviously, it did have a name and a phone number on it, but most of this was more just the picture of your son. There are a lot of people saying you should not have pictures of your kids anywhere because of the type of stuff that someone can do with video or what's your take on that? You heard that yet, and what's your take on it? I have not heard that yet. I would be curious of like what I mean, is it taking your kid's face and doing what with it? Is it that's the that's the concern, is that basically with the technology now you can do just about anything with it and without their consent or permission, the kids' per consent or permission, that by the time they get of age to understand exactly what's happening, their picture's out there, it's too late. Like, all right, how how is that swinging the pendulum way too far? Is there some legitimacy to that based on the fact that you just said you could say, hey, take this kid right here in this picture and show a video of them robbing a bank, you know, down the road.
SPEAKER_03:And I I I was listening to a podcast on the way down here and was talking about anxiety, and it was talking about the best way to deal with anxiety is being prepared for anything. And I think you know, that's something that we've like there's instances where I get anxious now, but it but most of it is like screw it, I'll deal with it. Right? If it happens, we'll just deal with it, we'll figure it out. Like, and I think taking that approach to life has helps tremendously. Like, no matter what happens, I'm gonna deal with this best I can. Um, I can't change the way certain things make me feel, but I can change the way that I deal with those particular things. So in these instances, I kind of look at it like I do with personal information. Like we're we're we're past that. You know, you can jump on and use cloaked or one of those apps to remove your information from the internet. Okay, right. Like, come on. And so I think it's just like we got to deal with it when it comes. Hopefully, things will evolve over time, and they will. We we're really good at that from a human perspective to deal with some of these particular situations. But like, I mean, you can there's already tools out there now where you can take a picture of a kid at two and forecast. Forecast, and it's probably fairly close. So, like, you know, if if somebody wants to be malicious, they're gonna try to be malicious. But for the most part, I mean, we're sitting here, all of us in our 40s, and knock on wood, none of us have dealt with any of that. Now, granted, technology has advanced significantly, but I just think that collectively as a society, we just we're gonna have to deal with it as it comes. And I think there will be people out there that have anxiety around this, and so and they they will try to control the uncontrollable, and it will lead to some regulations potentially that that make this a little less daunting. But I mean, I know and almost without exception, and I'm sure we all do. We've all had a friend or a handful of friends that aren't going to put pictures of their kids online. I've I've had, and it eventually fades out. Like they might make it three or four years, but eventually their their pictures show up online because guess what? It's more important for me to share moments with the people that I love that aren't living here or that may be interested, and vice versa. Like, I love seeing pictures of people's kids growing up and doing and experiencing that's that human connection is way more important to me than worrying about somebody taking some crazy ass action against you know my kid.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I I do post pictures of my kids on social media. I think maybe that maybe the first step in there is just to control that you don't have a public profile, right? Um, to where it's kind of somewhat limited, but I I tend to lean towards most people are good, good faith. And if someone's gonna do something like that, they're gonna find a way to do it. And I think it's gonna be impossible to keep your kids now. Whether your kids, when they're 18 and they're like, Dad, I can't believe you posted that. Now my picture is out and they had me doing this, like um, that's a whole nother kind of situation to to think about. But I I tend not to live my life in in fear. Um, but I would love to hear regulation-wise, like federal regulation versus other. I mean, you've you've seen the movies of like everyone has a chip in them, and you know, when you go in and out, everyone knows where you're at. Or um, if you're using software that has AI capabilities, it's watermarked. Like, what do you think that first step is gonna be? Because you jokingly said wait till the next the next election, like that's a legit, you know, you can't tell what the president or the vice president or the the soon to be and what they're running and the running mates and what they're saying. And there's already enough confusion as it is, because you take something that somebody says and you put it in two different contexts, it already means something completely different to to those people. And now all of a sudden you can make fake videos. Um, people will believe just about anything they see, and it'll create mass confusion. I'm just curious on the regulation side, what what what do you guys think is coming or needs to happen? I think the challenge with the videos and why regulation is so important is it's too costly and too slow to determine the origination of it. Like when you see a video out there, someone makes a fake video and the stakes are high and they're willing to do that. It's you can't quickly enough figure out where that came from, at least from my knowledge. Maybe there's some technology out there that I'm not aware of to quickly figure out exactly where that came from and take swift action. I mean, I have appreciated, I will say, the watermarks on the videos that say have some sort of like indication the corner AI generated to me makes the most sense. Now, how well, I mean, here's here's what policymakers and regulators have to think about. A regulation has to be enforceable, right? And that's gonna be the key thing that they're gonna have to put something out there that not only is the right regulation, but it's also something that they can measure and enforce. And if people are putting millions of videos out there, um again, hopefully they can leverage technology to be scraping the internet for these videos, and there's uh ways to determine either from back-end coding or really deep analysis of the video itself to figure out if it's AI generated. And but I just like that to me is gonna be the biggest complexity is whatever you put in place has got to be measurable and enforceable, otherwise, it it's not valuable. It's kind of like Napster when MP3s came out, it was a complete show, right? I mean, it was everywhere, and I mean it's a great parallel. Yeah, like you download an MP3 or you put it out on Napster, now of a sudden a million people have it, and how do you and so they were able to trace it and they started finding and actually going after people, and that's that's how they eventually then a new ultimately it led to streaming. Well, yeah, and so then a new software came out that was paid that wasn't stealing. I don't know if Spotify is as good for the artist or Apple Play, if they make as money, much money as when they were selling CDs, but it was an alternative that their hand was kind of forced, but they had to first of all, they had to pursue it and they had to go after people, and then they had to create a new tech.
SPEAKER_03:Well, I think it it's interesting you say that because what it has done from a music perspective is it has placed intense value on live performance. You look at the demand now for live performance and the skyrocketing ticket prices and things like that. Yes, part of that is because of the dichotomy between the rich and the poor, but the other thing is like that is now the truest exposure to art is going and seeing an artist live because music seems so commoditized in the digital sphere. I mean, I don't go a day. Without seeing an AI remix of a song. Like 50 Cent has just started posting in the last week AI remixes of his songs that he actually likes, like a 1950 swing version of in a club or whatever. And so you see those things. They, they're, they're the interesting thing is for me, it's fleeting. Like it's cool to listen to once or twice, but it's like there have been guys that have been covering it or parodying things with different tempos and in different in different musical styles for years and years and years. Um, but it's it's more fleeting. Like there's not that feeling you get. Um, and that speaks to other things, right? Um, a lot of artists thinking that they're conduits and that the music and the art comes to them from an entity. Um, but that's that's different. But yeah, it's it's uh I I think we should we should also have a conversation with Gemini here and ask it what it thinks about some of these things.
SPEAKER_01:That'd be great.
SPEAKER_03:Let's see if we can do that.
SPEAKER_01:That'd be great.
SPEAKER_03:Hey. You there? Great. So we're having a conversation about the advancement of videos um and how they're becoming more and more difficult to discern in terms of what's real and what's not. Are you aware of any legislation out there that's being proposed or any technology that's in development or that exists to help combat that?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, that's a really interesting question. It's definitely a growing concern. There are a few things happening on that front. For example, some researchers are working on developing AI that can detect when a video has been manipulated. There's also some legislation being proposed to regulate the use of deepfakes, especially in political advertising. Would you like to hear more about either of those?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, why don't we talk a little bit more about the deepfake side of things? You know, with the 2028 election around the corner in the United States, that could be a really big issue. Uh let's expound on that.
SPEAKER_00:The issue of deepfakes in elections is definitely a hot topic. There's a lot of concern about how these manipulated videos could be used to spread misinformation and influence voters. Some people are calling for stricter regulations on deepfakes, especially when it comes to political advertising. They want to make sure there are clear rules and guidelines in place to prevent deepfakes from being used to deceive the public. It's a tricky situation though, because you also don't want to stifle free speech.
SPEAKER_02:It's interesting. I just thought about this, and we can continue the conversation with her. But um could TV make a little bit of a comeback? You think about broadcasters and you think about like a uh where obviously it's a very controlled setting, controlled environment where you have entities that are, you know, at least trustworthy to some extent, not necessarily with the content that they publish, but at least with the legitimacy of it. You know, you think about debates, right? That are that would be if they're live. Correct. The live live debate Kamala where they edited her 60-minute thing, right? Like Yeah, I don't know that they like AI generated it, but they cut some things out that they didn't like or like that. It wasn't live. Yeah, correct. So I I'm I'm interested if that could be.
SPEAKER_03:I think you're right. I think that that live becomes much more important. Um, you're starting to see some of those trends, anyways. I mean, you look at the the and I don't know if this is, and I don't think this is necessarily because of AI, but you see um again how prevalent Twitch is. And I and I think a lot of I think it's this this double-edged, not double-edged sword, but it's this double um this secondary and tertiary benefits to live. Number one, we've recognized that because maybe potentially of technology and AI, um, live streams give people more feeling of uh more of a feeling of connectedness. We've talked a lot about like we we have not on the podcast, but in general talked about how like how can a kid be excited or enthralled about somebody doing an unboxing? And how big is that now? You've seen like guys getting online and doing a two-hour stream breaking packs. And oh, like that's what you used to do in person with people. You you guys would get together, you go to the store and you buy your cards and you'd open your cards together and see what you got. Now people are live streaming that, and so that's become a way for people to connect with other people. One of the biggest types of streams out there, uh, Asma Gold has built this empire on reaction streaming, um where they just watch things and because you want to align your emotional being with somebody else who perceives something the same way, and you guys, you know, you want to see. I I actually take like I actually get excited about it, like when uh somebody releases something that is like a crazy guitar solo. I want to see an experienced guitarist reaction to that because that informs how you know that helps me inform my perspective on something in particular. So like you're seeing a lot of that happen. And so I think you cut you compound that with the fact that um there's going to be a scenario where unless something is live, you can't necessarily believe it. It may be a complete transition towards that. Like if it's not happening here and now, and we have the technology today to basically live stream everything, um you you you're gonna lose a uh I think a modicum of authenticity if it's not something done live. So I think it continues to grow out of necessity.
SPEAKER_02:Let's shift to the workplace and um automation, AI, there's a lot of conversation about jobs. Um, there's conversations about universal income. Because universal income, for those um unfamiliar, is this concept that because there will be so few jobs, uh everyone will get a stipend because there's so much money being generated by automation and and robots and such that people will get a stipend, almost like being uh on Social Security uh a sense, but everybody would get some sort of stipend. Um, what is your guys' initial thoughts on automation is is and how quickly is it going to erode jobs? Before I get to that particular point, I don't know how universal basic income is ever gonna how we're ever gonna transition to that. Because I hear that a lot, but when you said it right then, my first thought is with our debt and where we're at as a country, that is gonna have to be paid by the government, which means businesses are gonna have to be taxed more. It's not like, well, if we became 30% more efficient at IMG, that money goes to shareholders or goes to investment in other technologies for the company. I don't know how we would ever get to a situation to where there's universal basic income because it would have to come from the government and it would have to be a taxation on something in order to how would you even see that happening? Well, think about a company having an 80% profit margin. If Apple on a trillion dollars of sales was making$800 billion. Yeah, but that goes back to the people that own the stock. But taxes are paid on a percentage of profit. So if profits continue to go through the roof from an automation perspective, to me, that's logically how where that's provided that all the money is taxable and it's not held in accounts in different countries. And one of the things to beat the system, not to mention the government gaining efficiencies and them finding ways to reduce their that's the kicker because they're spending that's never gonna happen. That's my point, is that the taxation with taxes could almost double and we'd still find a way of deficit and a spin deficit to where we would never. I can't see a future where we would ever position ourselves well enough to start giving a universal basic.
SPEAKER_03:Think about it this way. We know through our lived experience, I guess, there are different areas of life that you want to explore and grow in. None of us want to sit and work all day long. Um, you know, we want to we want to do things with family, we want to adventure and explore, we want to build things, whatever, whatever. So let's say if we continue, I mean, I just gave you an example of how I took something that probably would have taken me three hours and did it in a very short period of time. The the talk that I've heard as of recent is the continued shortness of the work week. So let's say that we get to a point where we're so superhuman from an AI perspective that I can do my job at IMG in two days, a week. As business owners, how hard is it to swallow that, like, okay, I'm gonna pay this person what I've been paying them? Because, you know, um, like our dad is a great example. Our dad has found his his value, his employee value was determined by eight to five, five days a week. If they didn't show up eight to five, five days a week, no matter what they did during the day, I mean, maybe a little bit here and there, but like that was the determinant factor as it related to how he valued his employees. So, as business owners, if employees get to the point where they can, outside of the ones that are maybe dealing with customers, or you figure out a way, right? AI gets so good that it actually is helpful from a customer service perspective, where it actually is, because right now it's still definitely not there. Um, where let's say all of your customer service stuff is being handled from an AI perspective, then you have somebody working two days a week, they want to make the same amount of money. Um and and it helps them fulfill the rest of their, you know, like, hey, I called Todd and a couple weeks ago.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So I actually heard that for the first time. I was listening to Joe Rogan and Bernie Sanders, and that's where I heard it. It was like Bernie Sanders was like, if AI continues to make things, you know, more efficient, now all of a sudden you have a four-day work week, but you pay them the same. Like, how many business owners or leaders are willing to do that versus take the profit margin? Right. And those are some of the conversations because what that conversation with Bernie Sanders um and Joe Rogan was talking about is like, there's so much purpose involved here. And I think the loss of purpose is the big, is the big concern. People don't have anything to do. Some people will find things to do, like that have other, but a lot of people find purpose and work. And will, I can tell you right now, publicly traded, financially driven companies are not taking that approach. They're cutting to the bottom line, they're maximizing profits, private equity-owned companies. You may see a little bit of that potentially in small business, but I don't think that'll be widely adopted because at the end of the day, people, most people are running a business for profit, for measure, and I think that's going to be the mentality. And if it's publicly traded or private equity owned, it doesn't stand for you.
SPEAKER_03:So if it's so if it's if it's one of those two, then is the end all be all sum dude is worth a hundred billion dollars and AI does everything for him?
SPEAKER_02:It is um that is very industry specific. So in distribution and customer service, going to a four-day work week is a dying business. Because if automation can do it, what's gonna happen?
SPEAKER_03:Three-day work week, two-day work week.
SPEAKER_02:If automation can handle this in the insurance business, so people know the insurance business, we're distributors of carrier products. There's your Liberty Mutuals out there, there's your your progressives, there's your Geikos, there's your whoever. If AI can do what we do, they'll do it. Sure. We won't have a value proposition. So what we have to do is we've got to do the job we do now in two days a week, and we got to figure out actually how to re-innovate or reinvent the value we're adding to the client in the other three days a week. If we just go down to two days a week, I mean, that would be the case. Technology has introduced, I mean, Ian, that that's been happened over the last few decades, right? Like there's so much efficiency in technology and systems and whatever. What our team's able to do in five days a week, uh, or in two days a week now, probably took five days a week. Everything was paper, everything was written down, you know, all that sort of stuff. And so we have found other ways to reinvent our value proposition. So we're still meaningful as distributors. And that to me is the bigger conversation, is and I IBM talked about this. It's like they had introduced a ton of automation, but their employee footprint, their CEO is talking about their employee employee footprint has increased because they have been reinvesting into new ways to add value. And I think that's going to be the trick is what can we offer? And in certain lines of business, it may be nothing, right? It may be very, very difficult to offer something that, you know, and you may see, I mean, you've seen that over time, right? Distribution channels have slowly fizzled out and disappeared because technology has gotten so good to connect the end consumer with the originator of the product or service. And so for me, that's where I think we've got to be very careful that we don't just sit and relax uh and and uh start counting our chickens because we won't have a business.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I mean, I think that there, I think one of the things that is going to be intriguing is the is human authenticity. And we've we've talked about right now, today, you can pretty easily discern between what has been AI generated and what isn't, especially when it comes to things like emails and and whatever, whatever. You can kind of, there's a tone to it. Even listening to Jim and I talk, she was very generic. There wasn't anything really deep about her answers. It was just like it was she was kind of being rhetorical in certain senses, and and so like maybe we could have driven a little bit deeper, but at the end of the day, I think that you know the the basis of our existence and of society is the ability to tell stories, and that's the basis of marketing, right? And so you're seeing that I was having this conversation with somebody the other day about um how important that is now and how important it is to build an authentic brand and all of the components that that are piece of that because I believe that we are on, and I think it was you I was talking to, but whatever, I think we're on the cusp of really seeing an opportunity present itself, it was you, um to build on the back of creativity because everything right now is so data-driven and so AI driven, and I think there's gonna become this gap. People are gonna rely so heavily on those technologies that there's gonna be a different opportunity as it relates to being able to flex those muscles. But um, I think the hope is that uh there is always the ability from a human perspective to discern authenticity to to a point. And I and maybe there won't be right now, but but for me, I can get online and if I hear a song, I can probably tell you whether or not that was AI generated. Or if I see a video, I can probably tell you whether or not, just not necessarily even based on the quality of the medium itself. It could be it could sound perfect, it could look perfect, but there's gonna be something potentially a little off there. And so I think one of the value adds, hopefully, we'll always be telling an authentic story with a human touch that will be received differently than something that was created by a computer.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe that's not the case and I'm being naive, but um, I think part of that, the discernment, I think may be there for people looking for it and for people that care, right? And so I think there's also an element of this if I'm a consumer of insurance and I can get it a little bit cheaper by going directly to the carrier, because the carrier doesn't have to, the insurance company doesn't have to pay a commission to a distributor like an independent agent, but I know I'm getting super sound advice on what the right coverage is for me in my situation. Here's my family, here's where we live, here's the address, here's the whatever. And AI can assure me that I am, I'm not sure if I care, it's genuine authentic, as long as I feel the quality of the information is there, at least in those particular things.
SPEAKER_03:I wonder if we're becoming desensitized to that. You know, because if you look at, we just saw a post somebody posted on Facebook about AI, and they wanted to talk to the sales or the customer service team. You tend to see, and I feel like this even today, I will fight somebody over Delta trying to make me use their text text message support. It's awful.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Um, so you know, I tend to want to get on the phone and talk to an actual human. And if you've ever dealt with something like Xfinity, they want to run you through. And in a lot of instances, if you're a consumer that isn't maybe tech savvy and resetting your modem will fix your Xfinity problem, that's great. But boy, if you've already done all of those things and you're it can take 10 minutes to get through the phone tree to get to where you want to get. So, from that perspective, you know, I wonder if the younger generation is so much more used to that type of engagement and this automated engagement that they have a lower bar of what can be delivered when you actually talk to a real human. And as as they get to the point where they're buying insurance, they don't care. It's just like you said, it's only about sound advice, it's only about ensuring that I'm getting the right coverage at the right price and it's saving me$10 a month or$15 a month by going this route. I don't really care about customer service at all because my bar is so low.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I believe the buyer is going to be a big part of this. You know, one of the things that would be interesting is there are going to be industries that AI doesn't touch or very, very little. Um, and so businesses have life cycles, right? I mean, you look at some of the biggest businesses in the 90s, don't even exist now. And some of the biggest businesses now were developed in the early 2000s. And so it'll be interesting. Maybe distribution is one that we see a very shrinking market increasingly over time. I mean, there's a way to specialize and and become the the expert and create niches, and those things are gonna probably hang around for decades. But maybe there are certain channels of businesses that become obsolete over time because those things are AI driven. But the interesting as you think about the future, and if like you were like, hey, what should I invest in? Um, there are several businesses that I can think of right now that AI is not going to play a major role in or probably replace a lot of people in. Let's talk about those. You guys got any that come to mind? Yeah, I mean, I I think I was just having a conversation um with someone the other day. I mean, a lot of businesses that surround our physical workspaces or places we live and work, um, I think real estate in particular, not necessarily from a realtor perspective, but in terms of kind of property management, those sorts of things. I feel like, you know, restoration, those sorts of things, things around our physical environment, the trades, plumbing, yeah, HVAC, making sure things still work. You're probably not gonna get an AI robot to come in and analyze your heating system or air conditioning system.
SPEAKER_03:Not in the next 20 or 30 years, but I mean, there's already robots that are articulate enough to walk in a house and but but it's it's not it's not scalable at this point.
SPEAKER_02:So the trades are something that's probably gonna survive and are becoming more. I mean, I don't know about you guys in your area in Indy, maybe there's more of this, but to get a residential contractor here is borderline impossible. They are so busy, they're so hard to get to come out, and then the deadlines like you just take it times three, like they're literally impossible to find. So those I think are a big one. We spend a lot of our time on this podcast talking about sports and athletics. Let's go there. Like the development of kids and youth sports, do you think there's gonna be any impact to that at all?
SPEAKER_03:I mean, I think it's upstream potentially, right? If if let's say, because a lot of today's wealth comes out of the technology sector or some version of that. I I mean, just based on the market cap, you know, and it it it just is what it is. As those jobs are potentially cut down, especially because the big programmers and the big private equity and the the large public companies, the largest companies in the world are really all technology based. And so as that as that income is potentially sales upstream, if you will, and some of these jobs are lost, that's where I think things could be impacted. Right now, maybe that wealth shifts elsewhere, but I think what we've seen over the last X number of years, it just continues to consolidate. I mean, my industry is pretty heavily technologically, you know. I mean, it's mobile phones. And we've consolidated tremendously. I mean, you know, when I started in this business, there were dozens of brands in each category serving the mobile accessory space. There were uh dozens of retailers serving the consumer. Now there are less than 10 that have any real viability. There are plenty Me Too brands living out there on the Amazons of the world and things like that. But when it comes to retail, it's like three or four brands that tell a story really well, or that had such a foothold that they've been able to weather the storm. And so I think as we continue to consolidate, it's going to be very interesting as the money continues to follow, funnel upwards. And I don't mean that from a negative perspective, but it is what it is. Is I mean, think about when we were little and how uh not even little in our 20s or teens and how enthralled we were with Bill Gates being worth$50 billion. That would he even be in the top 50? I mean, like, we're talking about people worth hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars now. As that continues to grow, you know, does does that impact these? Because I think we've seen a growth in that sector in terms of niche things.
SPEAKER_02:What what do you do if you're an employee at this point, right? You're your employee that may or may not be in a what's interesting about the industries that aren't going to be disrupted, at least for a very long time. That could be servers at restaurants, it could be uh the trades, there are other things. Healthcare healthcare. Yep, healthcare for sure. Nurses. Um there in a lot of these, I think a lot of what's discouraging about them to a lot of people is there's not a lot of growth opportunity, right? That it's kind of something that you do and you maybe get better at it over time, and you can work on some more complex things or more complex patients or whatever. Like, but let's just talk more broadly about an employee who may or may not be in an industry uh that is going to be eaten up by AI at some point. What what do you do? Do you try and retool yourself, reskill yourself? Do you you know, within that industry? Maybe it depends. Like, how do you handle this? If you're someone who maybe has still has a 30-year runway, I mean, those with 10 years left are probably, you know, can run that out in most cases. But if you got a 20 or 30-year career left, like, what do you do? Wouldn't you I think you the where where you have to start is like, how do you even analyze that? Like, how would you know, like my job has only got a 10-year shelf life? Now, I mean, you can make some assumptions, but I think first is like, how do you really how could you gauge whether it's 10, 15, or 20, 20 years? So where where would you start there? Like, how would I what type of analyzation should I do to know if my job is going to be super relevant in the next 10 years? Maybe it's a chat question of like, what are the most likely jobs to go away? I'm gonna ask it. Hey, why don't we just ask her? Yeah, go ahead.
SPEAKER_03:What industries will be uh Hey, what industries do you think will be the most heavily impacted by AI? In terms of job losses? AI's impact is pretty wide in terms of job loss.
SPEAKER_00:AI has some studies suggest that AI could automate a significant percentage of jobs in the coming years. However, it's also worth noting that technological advancements have historically led to the creation of new jobs in industries. It's hard to say for sure what the long-term impact will be. What are your thoughts on this?
SPEAKER_03:I want you to give me, let's say, five jobs that exist today that you think could be eliminated in the next, let's call it a decade. I want a very succinct and straightforward answer.
SPEAKER_00:Okay, here are five jobs that could be significantly impacted by AI in the next decade. First up, we've got data entry clerks who AI can automate a lot of that input stuff. Then there's customer service reps, chatbots are getting really good at handling basic inquiries. Next, we have telemarketers, AI can handle those outbound calls and lead generation. Fourth, we've got factory line workers, robots are getting more sophisticated and taking over those repetitive tasks. And finally, cashiers, self-checkout, and automated payment systems are becoming more common.
SPEAKER_03:So if you could give me a couple of industries, let's do three industries that you think will have significant shrinkage over the next decade as it relates to some of their um elements being able to be replaced by AI.
SPEAKER_00:All right. First up is manufacturing. AI-powered robots are getting more advanced, so we might see fewer humans on those assembly lines. Then there's transportation. Self-driving trucks and delivery drones could mean fewer drivers on the road. And finally, there's customer service. Chatbots and AI assistants are handling more and more of those interactions, so call centers might shrink. Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, thanks. That's all we got. Appreciate it.
SPEAKER_02:I love how you thinked an AI.
SPEAKER_00:Let me know if you want to explore any other topics.
SPEAKER_02:You called it a let's let's ask her, and DJ's saying thank you. And it it's it's tech, but like we've almost there's this thing of like it's almost formulated as a person. Like it's gotta it's transportation's super interesting. You want to talk about because that has been an exploding industry.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Huge, huge industry.
SPEAKER_02:But if you look at like I think one of the interesting parts, if you look at an Amazon warehouse compared to, I don't know, in a warehouse that's not so sophisticated by a larger distributor, the technology, it's mind-boggling what they can do and how robots go fill orders and go do things. Um, I don't know if some of the larger, other major retailers how sophisticated they are, but I could, I mean, it would be an incredible capital investment for some of them to move over, but that's why Amazon will have the package to you in the same day. Well, in that next two weeks.
SPEAKER_03:And that's speaks to, you know, a company I used to work for, they started to use robots and they're smaller. I mean, you know, they're they're big in our industry, but they're not anywhere near that. And I think that's such an intriguing thing. Amazon's so intriguing because it affects the industry at so many different levels. You know, uh, our organization is they want to explore direct to consumer. You almost have to use Amazon's fulfillment because what costs you$7 to ship to a customer, you could do it through Amazon's fulfillment for$350, you know, even with them taking their fee. And so it's like it's it's hard to catch up in that regard. But to that point, the the Amazon warehouse, it's already set up and automated and has robots and all of these things, they're just getting more and more and more and more business because we can't fulfill through our in-house employees and then another carrier like UPS or FedEx at anywhere near uh the same cost. So it's it's already happening.
SPEAKER_02:If they ever figure out the last mile delivery and they can replace that, that's gonna be a crazy amount of jobs, like an insane amount.
SPEAKER_03:In Bentonville, when we when we're out there with Walmart, they're already doing drone delivery.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, there is drone delivery that's happening. It's just the regulations around the air space, really, really difficult. I think you know, going back to customer service, I don't know how much this can apply in like delivery. There's nothing that comes to mind immediately. But in customer service, I think what's important to note is that she said basic tasks. So when you're adding a vehicle to someone's insurance policy, or you're removing a vehicle, or you're, you know, doing very simple changes, you know, to a deductible or whatever. I think this all comes back to yes, it can automate the things that are happening today, but that doesn't mean that that's all the value that a customer service person can ask. So for example, we got somebody who has just come out with a software called Porch File, and it one of the things that it's really good at is taking pictures and determining valuation. So, what if our customer service reps, instead of just being there to process a vehicle, were going out to the clients' homes, taking pictures of all the different things at their house. So there was like an actual inventory of contents provable that when there was, if and when there was a loss, there was, you know, and someone might have some peace of mind about that. There, so I think those are the ways that we've got to think about, and that may or may not be valuable to certain clients, but those are the I think the things we have to start thinking about, being more innovative and how what our value proposition is. I mean, for what a lot of customer service reps get paid or even distributors get paid, it's a fraction of what is right. It's not a ton for someone paying a$2,000 policy, it's a hundred to a hundred and fifty dollars, you know, maybe a couple hundred dollars, depending on what it is. Like, and that's what 20 bucks a month? You know, it's 240 bucks,$20 a month. Can we find a way to? Add$20 a month to value to somebody? I would sure hope so. When you look at it from that perspective, it's less intimidating. But essentially that, you know, and certainly it may be, you know, at least tangential or even within the boundaries of insurance and that sort of thing. But I think that's how we have to start thinking, as opposed to oh no playing defense and just freaking out because someone can, you know, AI is going to be able to add vehicle suppression.
SPEAKER_03:I think you're right, customer service is going to become something completely different. And what customer service is going to be solving complex problems.
SPEAKER_01:Correct.
SPEAKER_03:You know, all of the which is actually great, right? Um, you're, you know, you may have the same number of people doing the service, but it's going to be that much more of a value add because there are going to be companies out there. Again, I see it in our industry where a brand is a dime a dozen. You know, it's like if you want something commoditized, fine, go buy it. Right. But if you want something that has value ads that's going to make your life easier, give you more peace of mind, which is something you necessarily can't quantify, then buy a brand that that has those those things. And I think it's very similar. You know, if you want real customer service, if there's something that, you know, uh, you know, you think if you value somebody being able to solve a complex problem for you, then you're gonna go that route. It's only gonna take one time where you decide to fly the airline that doesn't have customer service and you need to make a same J change and you're stuck somewhere for an extra day, you're never gonna do that again. And I think that's very similar. I mean, I think that's brilliant. That Porsche file thing, that's something that I've always had a little bit of an anxiety about. Because if my house burns down, guess what I have pictures of? Nothing or anything.
SPEAKER_02:You've got a really weird amount of stuff in your house.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I've got, you know, lots of random Halloween decorations and whatever, you know, that's worth quite a bit of money. But point being is like if somebody were to come and set a 360 camera in the middle of every room, hit hit capture, and they do that four or five times, and that uploads, and then all of a sudden, all of the random weird stuff that we have is is quantified, like that takes away worry. So I do think you're right, industries will um definitely spawn out of this. Again, I'm anxious to see what happens in the technology sector as more of this gets eliminated, and again, more of this potentially flows upwards. Like, you know, it's it's interesting. That that's a whole nother conversation for a different time.
SPEAKER_02:I was just gonna say, and that comes to leadership of a company. So if I'm an employee, I'm understanding and I'm asking my leadership what we're doing and what we're thinking about and how we're approaching this and how we're gonna solve for this. I'm I'm asking that question because if you don't have leaders who are creative and thinking about this and willing to take risks and offer services that people may not value, because it's gonna be experimentative, you're gonna offer 10 services and nobody's gonna give a crap about eight of them, but two of them are gonna land, and that's gonna be the foundation of cut your customer service journey going forward. And so if I'm an employee in addition to sure, there's some aspects of retooling, reskilling that may be relevant depending on what industry you're in. But I think it's also that you're asking questions of current employers or prospective employers if you're in interviews of how they're thinking about this. No, that's a great point. I mean, at the end of the day, I think it's going to enable us to do more and to be better before it ever starts taking jobs completely off the table, at least in our industry. Um and we have found ways to I mean, we have our own chat GPT version. We're empowering our team from a customer service standpoint to be um to be able to serve our clients better, to be able to have more information at their fingertips. And I think AI in the phase it's in now is less, I mean, it clearly is replacing certain jobs, but it's less replacing and it's more of how do I understand it? How does the leadership team embody it? How are they trying to use it to maybe create efficiencies for growth? Right. And then that's the other thing. It's like, is your company growing? And how are they growing and what are they doing? So as you look at a company you're a part of, are you growing or are you dying? Right? Because there is a life cycle to a business, and that's why I think growth is so important is that you're continuing to evolve and figure things out because owning a business is a constant evolution. And yes, all of that, and I think what is important is human ingenuity and creativity is something that AI is a long way off on. Because you know how AI gets all of its insights by looking backwards at what's happened. Right. It doesn't have the capability. I mean, it it's certainly getting better and can put some pieces together, but it is fed everything that's happened and transacted. And so our ability, the human ingenuity and the creativity, that's where I think we can continue to play, especially leaders in an organization, is to invent the future in a sense and what that looks like, because I don't know how helpful AI will be on that, given again how it gets its knowledge and intelligence.
SPEAKER_03:Well, and also it's programmed. I mean, you know, what is it? The one of the versions got rolled back because it was such a sycophant. So, like AI needs to be pro if people want their views and perspectives reinforced. And AI, the current LLMs tend to gravitate towards that. So they will be, you know, you can lead them down the path pretty easily. They will reinforce if you word things the right way or you word it loosely enough, or you want to use it to support your perspective, for the most part, you can get it to do that. And I think that's uh an Achilles heel for it is that very rarely will it give you this um, you know, strong opposing view as it relates to your perspective on the world. And so that's that's a shortcoming that I think it has, and again, will offer us the opportunity to um, you know, be combat it in the future or or or whatever.
SPEAKER_02:I think there's a couple of things it's got to figure out. The other thing it's got to figure out is the hallucinations, and the reason I say that is the the balance between hallucinations but also giving meaningful, credible results, because that's what I think has happened with chat GPT-5. I'm sure there may be some other factors at play in terms of how it's trying to control the output. But one of the big improvements in Chat GPT GPT-5 was that it's supposed to reduce the amount of hallucinations. But in order to do that, it had to compromise, I think, a lot of the answers, the quality of answers that were coming in on different fronts with 4.1, that was just kind of a free-flowing fluid, give you whatever it wants, whatever it felt like, give you some really, really good stuff. But as you as you have to constrain and control and regulate the responses a little bit, I think it complicates. And I think it's got a lot of work to do to work out that balance. I mean, how much control is there for these companies developing these AI models with giving you what they want you or their because there's got to be some boundaries and perimeters? I take this back to like music. I heard this one time that everything that's on the radio was basically paid to be on the radio, and when radio was the only option, that's why those songs became popular because someone had bought those spots, and that's what you were exposed to, and that's what you liked, and that's how artists were developed. How much of that plays into AI, like the different mannerisms around the policies and how that what are your guys' thoughts on that? Outside of government regulation, I think they're gonna give us what we want. Any public company, publicly traded company, is gonna be incentivized to make more money, and they make more money by giving us what we want. That's why we have Fox News that only parrots out stuff on the right wing. It's why Facebook has these echo chambers for algorithms because that's what gets more clicks, that's what makes more money. So 100%, I think any AI company, now again, short of regulations or other things, or some very altruistic leader that comes in and tries to do things the right way and can win people over. I think the vast majority of them, especially with the amount of investment that's going into these, you know what kind of pressure the returns come with that? I mean, hundreds of billions of dollars. I believe in in uh Open AI's last fundraising, their valuation was 500 billion. Uh, and it's just it's insane the amount of financial pressure these institutions are under to create profits. And I think they're gonna have no choice to give us what we want.
SPEAKER_03:And that's and that it goes back to the comment I made earlier. And and as humans, there's nothing more validating than having your perspective validated on something. There's nothing more rewarding than having your perspective validated.
SPEAKER_02:But do you so you don't think like one will be more liberal and one more conservative, like Grok and Elon's thoughts, like you don't believe that they'll have different that's already out there. It just won't be one of the these underlying models, the five we're talking about now, I don't think people will interface with them a ton. I think maybe Chat GPT is kind of a consumer, but like, for example, there's one called Truthly. It's Catholic AI, and we were using it at breakfast this morning. And so it is a very conservative Catholic AI, and you ask it the questions and it gives you the specific answers. So you're gonna have these micro models or micro kind of filters, I should say, built on top of these base models that give people what they want to hear. There'll be conservative ones. Now, I think you're gonna have to be very careful uh it from a free speech perspective, and like how do they regulate that? And if you're telling, but uh, it's coming. Do you think that's a business model? Like, if you can go to like let's say I'm focused on insurance agencies and someone builds this layer on top of a chat or a Gemini, that's gonna be marketable to other agencies. Hey, we've already programmed this, this is gonna be able to do these things. It's already out there.
SPEAKER_03:This is already there, it's already there.
SPEAKER_02:So people are already selling that as well. Yeah, they're taking models and they specialize it to be trained in insurance specific things and tasks and they sell it. I think that's gonna be that's gonna be where people are gonna make. I mean, it's gonna make AI. I heard this yesterday. They said like over a 20-year period, the internet made so many millionaires or whatever. That's gonna be quadrupled in a quarter of the time when it comes to AI. It's gonna make so many people millions of dollars if they're willing to take the risk and put and and do it the right way.
SPEAKER_03:Such an interesting, it's so fascinating, and it sucks. And from a certain perspective, because it is gonna continue to the interesting, the interesting thing is gonna be what is the balance between truth seeking and echo chambers over the next 10 years? Because it's I I remember asking it. I may have mentioned this in our last podcast. There's a local basketball player, I'm gonna shout him out, David Mooney. And I remember going and asking, and he was a phenomenal shooter, probably in person, not professional, the best shooter we've ever seen. I mean, you know, this guy could come in and bank it on the baseline, like just either hand, huh?
SPEAKER_02:Either hand. He was shooting right and then shoot 10 left, and he'd go nine for 10, both hands.
SPEAKER_03:And I asked it, he played a Coastal Carolina, and um Tim Daly shout out, is known for embellishing stories uh here and there. And so I asked, you know, Chad GPT about him, but I asked it in pretty flowery language. Like I I kind of put David on a pedestal as I asked the question, and it came back, and you would have thought it was the second coming of Steph Curry, the way that it it brought back to me. It's like David Mooney was this, you know, legendary, next level, one of the best in the in the United States, because he played basketball kind of at the advent of the three, it was very young at the time. Um, and I started to come back at it and question its responses, and like 80% of what it had given me was not true. It was wild, but it was they wanted to reinforce my belief. What model was it? It was GPT, I could probably find it five or four one.
SPEAKER_02:Um, it might have been four one, which was he did hold the three-point record for many years, and he only had the three-point line for two years or something crazy like that. He hold it, he was pretty remarkable.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, he was unbelievable. But yeah, um David Mooney's shooting legacy.
SPEAKER_02:It's interesting. The hallucin, I mean, it brings back the hallucinations. That'll be an interesting problem to solve. You guys have anything else you want to add to the AI? I mean, I'm sure this will be a topic we'll hit once a quarter. So we've covered it.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Well, um, lots of great discussion. Uh, hopefully you don't leave this fearful. Um, you leave this conversation a little more educated or a little more confused. I'm not sure which, but um, really good insights. Thank you guys for sharing, and uh, we'll see you next time. Sweet.